Impact of the proposed Amazon Project on the Silm Film Project

What's next for the Silm Film Project?

  • Ignore Amazon's project. TV show? What TV show? Continue with Season 4 of SilmFilm as planned.

    Votes: 6 42.9%
  • Restart Riddles in the Dark to focus on Amazon's project while Silm Film goes on hiatus for a time.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • SilmFilm leaps ahead to the 3rd Age, covering LotR seasons before returning to Season 4

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • SilmFilm continues with Season 4, but with sporadic breaks for 'reaction episodes' to Amazon's show

    Votes: 7 50.0%
  • *keeping my fingers crossed for Corey Olsen's direct involvement in the Amazon Project*

    Votes: 7 50.0%

  • Total voters
    14
  • Poll closed .
I think that it will take some time before the Amazon project begins to take form. In 2005, GRR Martin met Benioff and Weiss and agreed that they could work on an adaption of Game of Thrones. They pitched the idea at HBO in 2006 and HBO bought the rights in 2008. Even if we skip some of that time because Amazon have already bought the rights, it will take at least a year to write something substantial, and then they will begin pre-production in 2019 at the earliest, with casting and looking for locations and so on. We will probably not learn anything about their project until sometime in 2019, so my guess is that this project can go on for at least another season.

My feeling is that, if we jump ahead to Third Age, something will be lost. I'm looking forward to working on the stories of the First Age.
 
I think that it will take some time before the Amazon project begins to take form. In 2005, GRR Martin met Benioff and Weiss and agreed that they could work on an adaption of Game of Thrones. They pitched the idea at HBO in 2006 and HBO bought the rights in 2008. Even if we skip some of that time because Amazon have already bought the rights, it will take at least a year to write something substantial, and then they will begin pre-production in 2019 at the earliest, with casting and looking for locations and so on. We will probably not learn anything about their project until sometime in 2019, so my guess is that this project can go on for at least another season.

My feeling is that, if we jump ahead to Third Age, something will be lost. I'm looking forward to working on the stories of the First Age.

My take on it is that much of what the Amazon series will cover is the period in which we have set most of our frame story, and if we jump ahead to cover what they are, we will be eating up our own future frame material. Additionally, we have to keep in mind what effect changes to the storyline would have on the past here. It is a lot easier to look forward and see what the butterfly effect of our adaptation will be. Looking back is a lot less clear. I'd hate for us to paint ourselves into a corner with this.
 
I might be repeating myself here, but since the discussion is rolling again - I very much do NOT want to skip ahead, for pretty much any scenario of Amazon status I can imagine. The Amazon project will have no more and no less impact on my participation in this imaginary just-for-fun project than Jackson or Bakshi or Rankin-Bass or the BBC drama do/did. Even if they were to fool everyone and start with the story of Beren and Luthien, just as we're getting in to S6 Beren and Luthien (aside - I'm more convinced every session that we need another season in between now and then), I would want to stick to our guns and do our own version.
 
I agree with the general sentiment here that we should keep moving forward with the First Age material. It's just too early to start thinking about Third Age material that might be used in an Amazon series. We don't know if the Amazon series will ever happen, or when it will start--it could be 2 years, or 5, or 10 (shows sit in "development" for years, or indefinitely, sometimes). Also, without knowing what pre-Party material is going to be covered (and we're likely to have a good idea about that only after casting decisions are announced) we risk putting a lot of effort to plots that Amazon decides to ignore. If there is genuinely more interest in discussing adaptation of late Third Age material than First Age material, then go and do that, but not, at this stage, because of the possible Amazon project. (I, personally, am more interested in the First Age stuff--that's why I came to SilmFilm).

We can always revisit a decision to keep going with SilmFilm in a year or two as tings develop. It's much harder to go the other way (going back to the First Age stories after you have left them behind for a few years).
 
My take on it is that much of what the Amazon series will cover is the period in which we have set most of our frame story, and if we jump ahead to cover what they are, we will be eating up our own future frame material. Additionally, we have to keep in mind what effect changes to the storyline would have on the past here. It is a lot easier to look forward and see what the butterfly effect of our adaptation will be. Looking back is a lot less clear. I'd hate for us to paint ourselves into a corner with this.
These are real concerns, especially since we don't even know what they will cover. Sabotaging our own frame would be counterproductive, and also unnecessary if we could just pre-empt Amazon in our frame while still continuing with SilmFilm.

We can always revisit a decision to keep going with SilmFilm in a year or two as tings develop. It's much harder to go the other way (going back to the First Age stories after you have left them behind for a few years).
This is perhaps my greatest concern. If Corey Olson spends 2-3 years on the Third Age, that project will gather momentum and he might never, ever return to the SilmFilm. Creative projects that lose their momentum are often abandoned permanently, even if the author(s) started them with great enthusiasm -- I've seen it happen, and I've done it myself more than once. That would be a shame.

A Third Age-only project would probably lose my interest after a while, honestly, unless it was very brief and we returned quickly to the SilmFilm. My attention usually doesn't stay fixed on one single fictional universe for many years at a time, I go visit other settings I also want to read/watch or reread/rewatch. I was planning to stick with SilmFilm for the long-term, since The Silmarillion (and associated HoME, UT, Narn, etc.) is my very favorite work of fiction... but the Third Age is just less interesting to me.
 
Last edited:
I did not come here to do the Third Age. I came for The Silmarillion, and The Silmarillion is much more than the Third Age. I just hope to get to the Great Tales, which interest me most of all.
 
It seems that there is some news on this front. Peter Jackson seems to be set to become involved in the Amazon project.

Likely, his involvement is necessary for any continuity between the films and the TV project. But whether his role will extend beyond 'consultant' or if WETA would have anything to do with it is yet to be determined. Here is what I've seen thus far.


https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/l...v-series-landed-at-amazon-not-netflix-1099213
https://thewertzone.blogspot.com/2018/04/peter-jackson-in-talks-with-amazon-over.html

The second article suggests that Amazon will be moving forward within two years, and that it is planned to be a five-year television series. I'm not sure whether that's confirmed or conjecture, though.


There was an April Fools joke that del Toro would be involved in the Amazon project, but there is no truth to that.
https://twitter.com/RealGDT/status/980509522274824192
 
It will be interesting to see how they make five seasons of television series of the material between the Hobbit and LOTR, if that really is the plan. I’m not too happy about the PJ involvement or the idea of such a narrow focus - I was hoping to see Tom Bombadil and the scouring of the Shire. But maybe that can happen and PJ is just a consultant contributing with his exceptional experience.
 
So, it has been a year now. Here's an update on what is currently known about the Amazon project:
https://www.pastemagazine.com/artic...-we-know-about-amazons-lord-of-the-rings.html

In May, Amazon confirmed that the first season of their TV show will focus on the adventures of young Aragorn.

Over the summer, Amazon selected Showrunners JD Payne and Patrick McKay for their TV show.
https://www.theverge.com/2018/7/29/...th-jrr-tolkien-jd-payne-patrick-mckay-writers

The show is not in production, of course, so no air date has been officially declared, but the vague hope of 2021 has been put out there.

The idea of filming in New Zealand has been commented on, but nothing official there yet, either. It looks as though any involvement of Peter Jackson will focus on, 'Can we borrow your sets?'

Silm Film is (obviously) moving forward with Season 4. Mythgard's reaction to the Amazon project is as yet to be determined.
 
This is the link to the final map, and it's a treat. We can see Numenor on the map, which probably means that the series will be about the fall of Numenor and so on. Extremely exciting!
 
Yes, it seems based on the place names and locations shown, their maps cover the time period between "some time in the Second Age" through "Early Third Age"

I'm very curious if they somehow purchased more rights than we have been led to believe.
 
I'm pretty sure only LOTR and the Hobbit are available still. Though there is a lot in there about Second Age stuff that I think you can get some narrative out of? Maybe? Time to reread LOTR with an eye toward Second Age stories.
 
The inclusion of Numenor is thrilling. And they can’t just tweet ‘Welcome to the Second Age’ if they just brush past the Second Age. I’m pretty excited.
 
Also, can we just take a second to appreciate that a major entertainment company is talking about the Second Age? That we're getting a story set in the Second Age? How cool is that? That is beyond my wildest dreams for possible settings for this series, I was leaning toward Young Aragorn Chronicles, or "Frodo's journey, but made longer this time". Second Age, man. I thought that was relegated to whenever SilmFilm got to it.

We may need an emergency podcast about this.
 
We are talking about the creation of the rings of power. The fall of Numenor? The Last Alliance. How much of this are they actually going to show??
 
I'm pretty sure only LOTR and the Hobbit are available still. Though there is a lot in there about Second Age stuff that I think you can get some narrative out of? Maybe? Time to reread LOTR with an eye toward Second Age stories.

Recall that these are newly-crafted TV rights, an independent beast from the film rights that JRRT sold in his own lifetime. So, it has certainly been implied that 'additional material' was included with this TV deal, but not the Silmarillion. So...who knows what they have? Permission to use a handful of names that don't appear in the Lord of the Rings? Rights to Unfinished Tales? The Akallabeth? They could have negotiated for any of this. Time will tell.

Obviously, the Tolkien Estate will not sell rights to the Silmarillion (film, TV, or otherwise) while CJRT lives.
 
Back
Top