Moved from Women Fighters thread:
The reasons why I think we need additional Sindar:
We'll need a stable of multiple named Elves available to die (in actual battle, not just by assassination) over the course of the Fall of Doriath, the Second Kinslaying, and the Third Kinslaying. Right now we don't have enough named Elves available to die during all of those battles.
We'll need warriors present during the Fall of Doriath and the Second Kinslaying who we can put into mortal danger. We can't do that with Galadriel and Celeborn because the audience already knows that they'll survive, so there's no tension in their participation in the battle -- if they're even present in Beleriand still.
In addition of course there are multiple ways that making them related to Celeborn would give us additional story options -- making Celeborn's 7000-year prejudice against all Dwarves everywhere less unsympathetic, giving us a meaty conversation about reconciliation and his engagement to Galadriel, giving us people to actually attend his wedding (Eldarin wedding ceremonies include only the close relatives, and nobody else), etc.
Is there any way that making one or two of these Elves related to Celeborn would cause harm?
My question, as always, is why not? If we do need additional named Sindar, what harm would be caused by making them related to Celeborn? I could understand if people were against this idea because they felt it would cause a problem. But the only reason given for opposing this is that I can't prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the project will be ruined without them. It wouldn't be ruined. But I've noticed that no other ideas have to be proven absolutely necessary just to be considered possible.I'm starting to come around to having more of Celeborn's family survive, but I'm wondering why the roles you laid out (recently, in a list that I can't seem to locate right now) have to be filled by Celeborn's family, and not other non-related Sindar?
The reasons why I think we need additional Sindar:
Thingol cannot be the only person who does any of the above things (edit: he can't do 4 or 5 at all). For example, if he's the only Sinda who dislikes all Noldor after the Kinslaying reveal, it will look like his personal problem instead of a sentiment widespread among many Doriathrin Sindar, that Luthien has to try to talk them down from. We were going to give Luthien a role in diffusing the Sindar from having a huge angry reaction... which requires her to interact with Sindar who have such a reaction. That'll be unimpressive and meh if Thingol is the only Elf who doesn't want reconciliation while his subjects look 100% united in wanting to reconcile. Right now Luthien, Celeborn, Cirdan, and Melian are all going to urge reconciliation, and Thingol alone is reluctant to reconcile. Beleg is going to befriend Gwindor so he doesn't appear to be in the anti-Noldor camp either.I've now accumulated a large pile of roles/events for which we need a Sinda, for which Mablung, Beleg, and Daeron will be unavailable. We need somebody besides Thingol to: 1. voice distrust of the Noldor (without making Daeron always the bad guy), 2. be anti-reconciliation with the Noldor, 3. still be alive by the time Doriath falls, 4. die in the battles of the fall of Doriath and the 2nd and 3rd Kinslayings, and 5. get Elwing to safety. We'd benefit from a scene of Celeborn discussing his engagement with his relatives, and getting a variety of reactions. We will need at least one, probably a few new Sinda(r) at some point, and the Hosts have never given any reason why making that Sinda related to Celeborn would ruin the project.
We'll need a stable of multiple named Elves available to die (in actual battle, not just by assassination) over the course of the Fall of Doriath, the Second Kinslaying, and the Third Kinslaying. Right now we don't have enough named Elves available to die during all of those battles.
We'll need warriors present during the Fall of Doriath and the Second Kinslaying who we can put into mortal danger. We can't do that with Galadriel and Celeborn because the audience already knows that they'll survive, so there's no tension in their participation in the battle -- if they're even present in Beleriand still.
In addition of course there are multiple ways that making them related to Celeborn would give us additional story options -- making Celeborn's 7000-year prejudice against all Dwarves everywhere less unsympathetic, giving us a meaty conversation about reconciliation and his engagement to Galadriel, giving us people to actually attend his wedding (Eldarin wedding ceremonies include only the close relatives, and nobody else), etc.
Is there any way that making one or two of these Elves related to Celeborn would cause harm?
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