"Don't let me forget this idea..."

Ilana Mushin

Active Member
I know this is way ahead of where we are with the script but I have an image in mind that I’d love to be incorporated if possible. When the Eagles rescue B&L, they fly over Gondolin but Luthien is too busy crying and Beren is unconscious so neither of them see it. I’d love the POV to switch at that point to Turgon in Gondolin looking up at the Eagles and then hearing a couple of adolescent boys in the background that Turgon then turns to join, leaving the Eagles to continue across the sky. It would be a total Easter Egg on Hurin and Huor, but would also remind viewers that Gondolin is still the glorious hidden kingdom (since we haven’t seen it for a while).
 

MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
Here's a thread for scene suggestions for episodes we haven't gotten to yet. Probably best if you can note with Episode it is meant to be part of, if possible.
 

Ange1e4e5

Well-Known Member
I think Húrin and Huor would have been gone by then, given that they only stay in Gondolin for a year and Túrin is explicitly said to have been born during the events of Beren and Lúthien. Plus, Húrin has been Lord of Dor-Lómin for a couple years by that point after his father Galdor was killed.

Unless the timeline and ages are jumbled around.
 
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MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
Here is the family tree for Silm Film for the House of Hador:

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As of right now, Galdor's death is in FA 462, just as in Tolkien's timeline. In that timeline, the Beren and Lúthien story would take place in FA 465-466 (so, yes, after Galdor's death).

We know that we are altering the timeline for Beren and Lúthien. Beren is not going to spend four years on his own in Dorthonion, but is going to leave immediately after the deaths of the outlaws. So...we have some choices to make about timeline.

Episode 1 opens with 'aftermath of the Dagor Bragollach' storylines. We know that the battle was in 455. So, this will be in the next year or so. Presumably, everything in the episode happens around FA 457.

Episode 2 deals with Thuringwethil's plot and the deaths of the outlaws in Dorthonion. That can be a couple of years later, but probably isn't 10 years later. So, probably FA 460.

Then we cut 4 years from the story.

So, now the Beren and Lúthien story is taking place roughly in FA 461-462.

We are keeping the Unnumbered Tears at FA 472.

So...if we want Beren and Lúthien to fly over Gondolin while Húrin and Huor are there, we could make that work.
 

Ange1e4e5

Well-Known Member
Well, aren't Húrin and Huor already gone from Gondolin by 460? They're only in there about a year in the books and that's from about 458 F.A. when there's an Orc incursion into Brethil where the two boys are lost.
 

kanji_d

Member
I don't think there's a problem with the POV shot, but yeah I'm not sure that we can get Húrin and Huor in there. The timeline is just a couple years off.

Now, if we want someone else there, we always have Idril and Maeglin available. But there's no reason for them to be there and it might be best with just Turgon alone.
 

Odola

Well-Known Member
I don't think there's a problem with the POV shot, but yeah I'm not sure that we can get Húrin and Huor in there. The timeline is just a couple years off.

Now, if we want someone else there, we always have Idril and Maeglin available. But there's no reason for them to be there and it might be best with just Turgon alone.
Idril would be nice, as she does marry a mortal too, later.
 

kanji_d

Member
Aside, but since I won't be there for the episode 2 discussion I thought I'd bring it up here so you can make a note of it: when Morgoth grants Dorthonion to Sauron, that's when I want Sauron to take the name Thû. I really want that name to come up this season and that seems the best place to put it.
 

MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
Unfortunately my internet cut out before the end of the session last night, but I figured I would stick this here anyway:

Lúthien asking Beren to wait for her in Episode 11 should probably have an element of "Don't you go where I can't follow!" Meaning, yes, she is asking him to wait for her, but her fear and grief over losing him in that moment should be clear. Frodo's speeches don't sound right in Beren's mouth, but I think Sam's speech fits for what Lúthien is experiencing there. Her powerlessness in this situation should be clear, so that Beren's actions are clearly driven by his own power. Her 'escape from deathlessness' starts with her grief at losing Beren so soon (though no matter when he died, it would have been 'too soon'...this is still very soon.)
 

Kathrin

Well-Known Member
Oh I have an idea i wanted to drop here: I've recently become a self-radicalised Mim the petty-dwarf fan, because i've been retranslating the "lost poem (/prose fragment)" about him from the 80's german translation, and that's why i started thinking about his storyline and if we should have him for a little scene in this season or next season again, or if he only resurfaces in the turin turambar season.

In the NoME, there is a small mention to Mim trying to kill Finrod in his sleep. That's supposed to be before the petty dwarves are expelled, which doesn't really fit, but there might also be a storyline at some point where someone lets in the petty dwarves or they make an attempt to get in, and it maybe plays into nargothrond politics too. aanyway just wanted to drop this here.
 

MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
Finrod will be traveling stealthily from Nargothrond to Tol Sirion this season, and there could potentially be a petty dwarf cameo where they see him from afar. Or someone could explain to the Fëanoreans that Amon Rûdh is off limits.
 

David_M_R

Member
@Kathrin "the "lost poem (/prose fragment)" about him from the 80's german translation" <--- can you remind me about this? I have a vague memory of something obscure being only published in translation like this, but I can't recall where I heard about it, or details.
 

Kathrin

Well-Known Member
@Kathrin "the "lost poem (/prose fragment)" about him from the 80's german translation" <--- can you remind me about this? I have a vague memory of something obscure being only published in translation like this, but I can't recall where I heard about it, or details.
It is from the Klett Kotta verlag Almanach, 70s to 80s. It is a translation by Hans J. Schütz. (the lesser known of the three big german tolkien translators (he did for example a lot of the secondary/background material). I've tracked down the book in our university library system, and i've been translating it back to english xD
 

Kathrin

Well-Known Member
@David_M_R Oh yeah i've seen that done. Though i dare say my translation is better. As a bonus it's in iambic tetrameter and it rhymes and everything ;) and plus i am a native (swiss) german (so, almost native german xD) speaker. Which helps.

I am still working on the prose fragment, where the absence of rhyme and meter doesnt give me anything to hold to, but i am very excited about the state of the whole translation already nevertheless. I only need to find out what to do with it once i am done.
 

kanji_d

Member
Reposting here from the last podcast's forum:

Could the scene in Ep. 11 where Beren and Emeldir are talking be where they come up with the whole "my hand is not here" bit? (Or another scene around it.) That's far too witty and clever of a line for even Beren to have come up with on the spot. It seems pertinent to set that up and that particular spot seems a good place to put it since his hand is being tended right then.
 
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