New Member
I was kicking this around at the end of class, but I couldn't quite find the right way to phrase it, so I had to leave it off.

In regard to "eye-opener," I wonder if there isn't a little authorial pun on an Edenic "eye-opener," a la "their eyes were opened." For a couple of people in the council, at least, the revelations at the council have involved a loss of innocence (or at least ignorance) with reference to the operations of evil (and good), especially when it comes to the unexpected treachery of Saruman.

Following the analogy, there is even a corresponding temptation to that seen in Genesis, embodied in the temptation to take and use the ring. An interesting contrast, then, could be seen in that the council actually avoids the temptation and doesn't fall into the same error as Adam and Eve. Redeeming things that have become corrupted is a very Faerie kind of endeavor, after all.

In reference to the larger ring quest, it actually makes an interesting contrast to the Eden story. Instead of starting in error and original sin, the council avoids certain temptations in order to undo the harm done by previous failures and errors. I don't want to make too much of a parallel, and it is a bit much to read into this wording, but I can't help but wonder if there is something here. Tolkien did say in one of his letters that ALL stories are ultimately about The Fall, so perhaps I am casting a bit too wide of a net here.


Well-Known Member
Hi Velconondil,

Good observation.

Genesis 3:5 "For God knows that in the day you eat from it (the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil) your eyes will be opened and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

Genesis 3:7: "And the eyes of both of them were opened, and when they perceived themselves to be naked, they sewed together fig leaves and made themselves aprons." (Happens right after they eat the fruit.)

I don't think this is a 'pun'. I guess rather a deliberate reference by JRRT?

Just as in Genesis, this 'eye opening' is both a revelation and a calamity, so it is for Frodo?