Mairon/Sauron

Shelby Seymore

New Member
The difficulty casting Sauron is that we're going to need multiple actors. This is because Sauron changes his appearance and name A LOT. You have Mairon, Annatar, Sauron, The Necromancer, etc.

First, (And most importantly to me!), is the casting of Mairon (the Admirable).

I want to go with Eddie Redmayne for Mairon. He's got the youthful innocence I think Mairon had when he was Aulë's smith. Plus he's got an Oscar, so great credentials! ;)

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(Sorry the pics are so big!)

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This is what I think of when I think of Mairon (not my art!) and then we could give him a more intimidating look closer to Annatar when he becomes Sauron.
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Just some thoughts! This is all supposed to be Sauron pre-Third Age by the way!
-Shelby Seymore
 

AzureSkye23

New Member
Personally, I feel like we need to keep the actors/design the same for all the Ainur, simply to avoid viewer confusion. But I definitely agree with Shelby that Mairon/Sauron needs to have a very 'innocent' look. After all, that's really what he plays on before the Third Age.

I don't have a specific actor in mind, but in terms of looks I do have a few ideas...

1. looks innocent/smaller than you'd think: it definitely fits his personality to have people underestimating him.

2. golden eyes! It's semi-canon after all. Plus, it definitely fits with the whole 'lord of werewolves' thing.

3. Personally, I prefer black hair. I can live with red. But *please* don't go with blonde/silver!!

<Not my art!>
(Sauron in Númenor)
Sauron_in_Numenor.jpg Originally_Feanor_but_totally_Mairon.jpg
(I think this was originally Fëanor, but it's definitely how I see Mairon when he's still with Aulë)
 

Shelby Seymore

New Member
AzureSkye23-

I love the red hair (with the freckles!)! ;) But definitely don't want Mairon to be blonde or brunette! Silver would make him look weirdly old or like Lucius Malfoy or a Targaryen. I was originally picturing Sauron with black hair and once he's Sauron, and not Mairon, I think that would be an okay. The reason I shy away from black hair is I imagine Melkor with black hair and I think that would be difficult visually if we have two menacing dudes brooding about with long black hair. ;)

Now one could make the argument that once Melkor has the crown this won't be difficult, but I like signature physical characteristics with the characters. Like your gold eyes idea! Love that! What an epic and wonderful idea!

I imagine Mairon as an ambitious/perfectionist personality who is a bit withdrawn. He's not the charismatic, bubbly personality, but that doesn't mean he's an angry or cruel person. He's just antisocial. Which makes him a perfect target for Melkor. Fits the Tolkien theme of those who go into solitude find darkness.
 

winrobee

New Member
I've had this idea that with the bombardment of audiences by the "man in the Iron Mask" imagery for decades, we would need a person with a strong presence onstage to introduce the fair form of Sauron, but not necessarily too fair, and there could be a hint of self-involvement. I think that the person to play this somewhat disarming Sauron is an actor who had been offered the part of Aragorn in LotR, to wit Nicolas Cage

 

AzureSkye23

New Member
Shelby--

I definitely think if we go with a red-haired Mairon he needs freckles. ;) I see your point with Melkor--you don't want two black-haired bad guys! But you see, my version of Melkor has pale-blond hair.
(definitely influenced by this! Still not my art!)
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So then to counter-point it, Mairon has dark hair.

I definitely agree that at the very least, the Ainur need defining characteristics that remain the same. Eye color is an easy one--and would work great for a character who's pretending to be someone else...cough*Annatar*cough....you can have the eyes flash to remind the audience who this really is. So I'm glad you like it. ;)

You're idea of Mairon and mine are pretty similar. I see Mairon as this kid who's so excited about Eä, but is rather shy, and doesn't know how to interact with people well. The self-possessed, suave 'Sauron' personality I see as something he developed to survive. But he certainly has an odd sense of humor: the whole calling Shelob 'his cat' thing shows that...
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
If we can use actors from any time - then we could cast Christian Bale, and have a young Christian Bale play Mairon, and an older Christian Bale play Sauron. That would be great, I think. He looked so innocent when he was younger; now he has a hardened quality, but can still be charming. (Sorry can't post pics)
 
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Chris Durston

New Member
I actually think Evan Peters could do okay. He could get that innocent look at first, and he could definitely do the darkness. I think if it was him he'd have to have blonde, wavy hair.
 

Shelby Seymore

New Member
Haakon - could we make Christian Bale Melkor??? That last pic is just spot on for Melkor as he's looking down on Manwë disapprovingly!

This goes great with AzureSkye's idea!


Is this the pale hair you were thinking of AzureSkye?

Your Melkor pic has me on board with the light hair for Melkor I think Manwë should have the same blond hair since they're brothers! That'd be too cool!!!



Haakon - Great idea with Christian Bale! I didn't even think of him!
 
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Shelby Seymore

New Member
In response to Azure Skye Melkor pic post:
Yes, I see Mairon as kind of taking things people say personally and is always self-conscious when Aulë or other smiths say something that might be a slight.

I see the "seduction of Sauron" as Melkor starts twisting things Aulë and the other smiths say further so that Mairon thinks everyone is against him except Melkor.

On a lighter note, is that a pic of Melkor just chillin' in the void? That's hilarious. I can see him in there sitting down, tapping his fingers on his knee and saying "Well, this sucks."
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
Haakon - could we make Christian Bale Melkor??? That last pic is just spot on for Melkor as he's looking down on Manwë disapprovingly!
That would be great I think. Personally though I see Melkor as more of a power hungry, wreckless, borderline type of character, while I view Sauron as a pure psychopath type, and I think Bale fits better in that role. Plus - did you see the Melkor thread, Benicio Del Toro? He would be a fantastic Melkor, wouldn't he? Think of those two together, Del Toro and Bale. What a pair!
 

Rowen

New Member
I was thinking along the lines of Jonathan Rhys Meyers, which seems to be the same as casting Edie Redmayne, honestly.
 

AzureSkye23

New Member
Shelby--

Your picture isn't showing up, sadly, so I can't tell you if that's the light hair I was thinking of. I do have Manwë and Melkor as very similar to each other, with Melkor being the paler: light blond hair, ice-blue eyes. Then Manwë with more golden hair, and sapphire eyes (he's tied to sapphires quite a lot in the Silm, and I think it is mentioned somewhere that he has blue eyes).
(Also: I think the pic is supposed to be him pre-Music.)

Going back to Sauron, though, since this thread is about him: I think he needs to retain an 'innocence' about him. I don't think we want to go to this dark, obviously cruel looking figure. He's known as the Deceiver, after all, and a big deal is made about him loosing the ability to look all cute and innocent. I see him as the figure that everyone goes, "wait, *that's* Sauron?". And he just gives them an innocent look and goes "No, my name is Mairon."

As for Mairon's seduction: I think whatever Melkor did, he had to get Mairon isolated, emotionally as well as spiritually. As well, if Melkor singled Mairon out, that would have to be slightly intimidating...I don't get the feeling Melkor is the type of person you say 'no' to very easily.

And this kinda goes into what Haakon was talking about: I see Melkor as a spoilt brat pitching a temper tantrum that daddy likes his little brother better (and you have to admit, it fits better than it should. ;) and Mairon as someone who has lost so much control in his life that he's desperate for it. Tolkien does say that Sauron isn't wholly evil until the creation of the Ring. After that...I think he just goes crazy. Which progressively gets a lot worse once he looses the Ring.

But I think that point needs to be portrayed, at least slightly: if Sauron isn't wholly evil until the middle of the Second Age, he's not irredeemable in the First. And he *does* repent at the end of the War of Wrath. If we write it well, the audience could mourn that he doesn't go back then...and I think that would be a great way to go.
 

AzureSkye23

New Member
Not to drag this thread away from Mairon...but Shelby, I might have found a use for Eddie Redmayne...As Aiwendil (aka Radagast)

(You should be used to this by now. Not my art!)
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Shelby Seymore

New Member
I blame Peter Jackson for my lack of interest in Radagast's character! But you totally re-intrigued me! I actually think Eddie might be better for Radagast as I've been thinking over the past few weeks because I think that Mairon needs to have a bit temper and a darker side...not sure Redmayne could pull that off. He's more innocent and I think he could totally pull off Aiwendil!

I'd like to see some interaction between Mairon and Radagast that we could retcon later on. Perhaps have Radagast recall what Sauron was like before he was Sauron while he is narrating. Just a thought! I think it's a Jacksonism that Gandalf and Radagast are so removed from Sauron. There needs to be a relationship there because they would have known each other and adds an incredible level to the Hobbit/LOTR that most readers don't understand.

However, I think that we need to keep a younger actor for Mairon. Perhaps a redhead...;) But more importantly they need to be young (under 30 in my opinion) so that they can keep the innocence that Mairon has while being able to portray his darker side that Melkor draws on. Once he is Sauron, or a little after, I think we'll change his actor into someone older, someone who would resemble Annatar. Just to refresh my image of Mairon. (Prepare thyself for redhair madness; Sauron can have black hair ;D)

I'm sure Corey would be viamently opposed to FemMairon/FemSauron, so I'll keep those pics off. (That was a joke ;D) I am a wonderful fan of the concept art of Suz on Tumblr! Here's a link to her site. It's called Impossibly High Barad-dûr Graffiti. But I pulled alot of her Mairon concept art and put it up here:

Screen Shot 2015-07-19 at 1.00.46 PM.png Screen Shot 2015-07-19 at 1.00.52 PM.png Screen Shot 2015-07-19 at 1.01.07 PM.png Screen Shot 2015-07-19 at 1.01.17 PM.png (Imagine Melkor blonde!)
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Here's an awesome baby comic because it makes me laugh! Just for giggles!

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Shelby Seymore

New Member
I was thinking along the lines of Jonathan Rhys Meyers, which seems to be the same as casting Edie Redmayne, honestly.
I like Jonathan Meyers...I just worry he's a bit too old for Mairon. Perhaps that because of his role on the Tudors and City of Bones (Oy, that movie!)...He actually would make a great Vanya elf I think because he has such distinctive features.
 

Shelby Seymore

New Member
Shelby--
But I think that point needs to be portrayed, at least slightly: if Sauron isn't wholly evil until the middle of the Second Age, he's not irredeemable in the First. And he *does* repent at the end of the War of Wrath. If we write it well, the audience could mourn that he doesn't go back then...and I think that would be a great way to go.
I cannot get over this! I love this! It fits very well with the Elrond quote, "For nothing was evil in the beginning, even Sauron was not so." We need to explain this.

This is especially true being as Sauron/Mairon is my favorite character of Silmarillion/LOTR! I have a personal problem because of how he is portrayed in Jackson's CME. He's portrayed as the Satan like character of Tolkien's Middle Earth. I can say this as I was a huge anti-Tolkien fan when the movies came out and for the longest time thought Sauron was the embodiment of evil and was not even a character at all. Of course, I was only watching the movies and I can't trash Jackson too much because if it wasn't for Jackson's Hobbit AUJ, I wouldn't be here.

I think Mairon/Sauron needs to be more characterized and have some personal conflict which is why your idea is so spectacular. He's not 100% evil. He's a being who is just as influenced by his environment as we are and that is why is he relatable to us and we could root and mourn for his decisions.
 

AzureSkye23

New Member
I definitely agree with you on Sauron/Mairon being one of my favorite characters in the legendarium. I've been working for years to compile a good case for why he's at the very least a tragic character. I also feel like Olórin, at the very least, should have known Mairon pretty well. The UT make it sound that way, certainly. My personal theory is that their brothers. ;) It fits the Middle-earth archetype so well. And it explains why Gandalf is constantly explaining what Sauron is thinking.

I've been watching that comic on Deviantart. I really like what she's doing with the characterization there. My own ideas are slightly different, but close enough I can enjoy it.

The only thing I think I disagree with is changing actors between uncorrupted Mairon and Sauron. I feel like that would be too confusing for the audience...as well as providing a nice disconnect that I feel like Sauron plays on a lot during the First Age. Getting people to believe there's no way he could be evil seems to be how he plays. I do agree though that we will need a new actor for Annatar.
 

Shelby Seymore

New Member
The only thing I think I disagree with is changing actors between uncorrupted Mairon and Sauron. I feel like that would be too confusing for the audience...as well as providing a nice disconnect that I feel like Sauron plays on a lot during the First Age. Getting people to believe there's no way he could be evil seems to be how he plays. I do agree though that we will need a new actor for Annatar.
I think I'm saying the same thing as you; I'm just saying a little differently! :p I didn't mean we change actors until he takes on his Annatar like state and then obviously when he's not allowed to take a pleasing form again. I think I was cramming those two together when I'm talking, makes sense in my head, but not on paper! Yes, keep Mairon actor until he is Annatar then later the Dark Lord Sauron (because that Sauron is the one losing his power and is corrupted).

BTW, love the Gandalf theory! Never would have thought of that! That makes everything that happened in The Hobbit/LOTR so much richer and intimate!
 
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