Raiment just means 'clothes' not 'fancy clothes' - the fancy connotation is simply because it's an archaic word not much used. But a *lot* of Tolkien's language (especially in Lost Tales, but also in LotR) is archaic, and he tends to use its original meaning. Now, if you say something like 'fair raiment' then yes, you're saying pretty clothes. But 'Angband's raiment, foul and sad,' is *not* fine clothing.
The orcs are actually wearing dun-colors as camouflage in the Nirneath as described in Children of Hurin, not grey, but whatever - the point was simply camouflage. I am not complaining about Morgoth fitting his armies in dark colored armor in usual circumstances, of course.
"Swart" obviously comes from the word for black - but as used in English, can refer to someone with dark hair and dark complexion. Like an Italian or Spaniard.
But no, seriously - it means that as much as it would mean that the orcs have a darker skin than that.
Also keep in mind that anyone is dark, if the lighting is right. Legolas' head is described as dark against the sky when he shoots down the Nazgul's steed, and so some artists have drawn him with black hair (particularly in that scene). Others have made him blond because of the frequent references to his fair features - but that is almost definitely meant to point out that he's a pretty elf. Tolkien never actually describes his hair color one way or the other, though Thranduil is of course blond. Thus, the Mordor orcs all refer to Gollum as a black creature, which has everything to do with him skulking in shadows, and is not necessarily a comment on his appearance. Likewise, the “black figures of many orcs” are seen across a chasm of firelight, and I daresay any creature would appear as a 'black figure' in those lighting conditions! And when Sam sees the orcs pass by while wearing the Ring, he sees them as grey figures, but that is almost definitely the distortion of the Ring, not what they look like under normal conditions.
There are references to skin tone - for instance, the tracker orc in Mordor is clearly black skinned, not just wearing black clothes or standing in shadows. And the Uruk-hai call the Men of Rohan 'Whiteskins', implying that their own skin (and that of the other orcs) is not white.
But, at the end of the day, I don't necessarily care if Tolkien very explicitly made all of his elves and men and hobbits pale white and all of his orcs black-skinned. What he was *going* for was unlovely twisted figures for the orcs, and I think we can do that...without sticking to only dark skin.
You made your case for the darker-skinned Avari, but the Execs didn't go for it. They decided on homogenous elves at Cuiviénen. We'll see in the casting on Friday who actually was chosen, but I would not be surprised if they vetoed choices that they don't think fit.
The orcs are actually wearing dun-colors as camouflage in the Nirneath as described in Children of Hurin, not grey, but whatever - the point was simply camouflage. I am not complaining about Morgoth fitting his armies in dark colored armor in usual circumstances, of course.
"Swart" obviously comes from the word for black - but as used in English, can refer to someone with dark hair and dark complexion. Like an Italian or Spaniard.
But no, seriously - it means that as much as it would mean that the orcs have a darker skin than that.Also keep in mind that anyone is dark, if the lighting is right. Legolas' head is described as dark against the sky when he shoots down the Nazgul's steed, and so some artists have drawn him with black hair (particularly in that scene). Others have made him blond because of the frequent references to his fair features - but that is almost definitely meant to point out that he's a pretty elf. Tolkien never actually describes his hair color one way or the other, though Thranduil is of course blond. Thus, the Mordor orcs all refer to Gollum as a black creature, which has everything to do with him skulking in shadows, and is not necessarily a comment on his appearance. Likewise, the “black figures of many orcs” are seen across a chasm of firelight, and I daresay any creature would appear as a 'black figure' in those lighting conditions! And when Sam sees the orcs pass by while wearing the Ring, he sees them as grey figures, but that is almost definitely the distortion of the Ring, not what they look like under normal conditions.
There are references to skin tone - for instance, the tracker orc in Mordor is clearly black skinned, not just wearing black clothes or standing in shadows. And the Uruk-hai call the Men of Rohan 'Whiteskins', implying that their own skin (and that of the other orcs) is not white.
But, at the end of the day, I don't necessarily care if Tolkien very explicitly made all of his elves and men and hobbits pale white and all of his orcs black-skinned. What he was *going* for was unlovely twisted figures for the orcs, and I think we can do that...without sticking to only dark skin.
You made your case for the darker-skinned Avari, but the Execs didn't go for it. They decided on homogenous elves at Cuiviénen. We'll see in the casting on Friday who actually was chosen, but I would not be surprised if they vetoed choices that they don't think fit.
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