Original sin - Elves vs Men

In MR and especially NoME we find that one of the main differences of the two Eruhin is that Men do inherit original sin (a tendency to evil) while Elves dont. But it is clear that Elves do sin. So I wonder what makes the first elvish sin to be not as devastating as the first human sin.

The follow up question would be what is the first elvish sin. To my mind come Miriel giving up, or Finwe being impatient, or Feanor being jealous. Do you know of any one before? The Avary staying behind? My examples are all Noldor sins and we see that the descendants do have a tendency to evil so maybe Tolkien was saying that there is no inheritable sin for the race of elves but there is inheritable original sin for Noldor?

But I dont think so. A fundamental difference of Miriel's sin and Eve's sin is that Adam and Eve lived in bliss in Garden Eden while the Noldor, although in the bliss of Aman, lived in Arda marred so you could say that their sins were consequences of previous sins and their surrounding. Garden Eden had everything for A&E (except one thing) and was perfect in contrast. Does that make their fault so fatal?

Or is it the kind of sin that makes the difference? A&E wanted to be God themselves by trespassing his one law. In contrast the elves never doubted Gods right or worshipped Melkor. I dont know what catholic theology says. Would Adam being simply lets say angry at God would that have had the same consequence for mankind?

Of course we cannot assume that the sin of A&E must be the same of the first humans in Arda. But in MR there is the theory that Arda was marred after human sin, so quite similar to Genesis. So it is not unfair to draw comparisons I guess
 

Odola

Well-Known Member
In MR and especially NoME we find that one of the main differences of the two Eruhin is that Men do inherit original sin (a tendency to evil) while Elves dont. But it is clear that Elves do sin. So I wonder what makes the first elvish sin to be not as devastating as the first human sin.

The follow up question would be what is the first elvish sin. To my mind come Miriel giving up, or Finwe being impatient, or Feanor being jealous. Do you know of any one before? The Avary staying behind? My examples are all Noldor sins and we see that the descendants do have a tendency to evil so maybe Tolkien was saying that there is no inheritable sin for the race of elves but there is inheritable original sin for Noldor?

But I dont think so. A fundamental difference of Miriel's sin and Eve's sin is that Adam and Eve lived in bliss in Garden Eden while the Noldor, although in the bliss of Aman, lived in Arda marred so you could say that their sins were consequences of previous sins and their surrounding. Garden Eden had everything for A&E (except one thing) and was perfect in contrast. Does that make their fault so fatal?

Or is it the kind of sin that makes the difference? A&E wanted to be God themselves by trespassing his one law. In contrast the elves never doubted Gods right or worshipped Melkor. I dont know what catholic theology says. Would Adam being simply lets say angry at God would that have had the same consequence for mankind?

Of course we cannot assume that the sin of A&E must be the same of the first humans in Arda. But in MR there is the theory that Arda was marred after human sin, so quite similar to Genesis. So it is not unfair to draw comparisons I guess
It is who sins imho. Adam was the representative of all humanity. So in a similar way like when the US president - the father of the nation - decides to enter a war, all of US is in the war, willing or not.

As such I think it is feasible that e.g. when an elf is "ocrified" his following family line becomes corrupted but not the whole of elfdom - similar we see with the progressive overshadowing of Eol and Maeglin or the progression from Miriel-Feanor-his sons. The only one who has "repented" here seems Celebrimbor - but still he stays accessible more for evil than others - he falls for Annatar's lies while others do not. Had Finwe fallen himself imho all Noldor would have been doomed, but Finwe stops short of falling completely, as such not all of the Noldor are doomed.
 
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