as Tolkien's works are already public domain in New Zealand

[Odola]

...could someone there theoretically host an open Tolkien fanfiction contest?
I assume Tolkien fanfiction can be published and sold in New Zealand freely now as long as it is not shipped abroad.
Would be probably a Mekka for the worldwide Tolkien fanfic community for the next two decades,
until the copyright expires in many other places?

 

[MithLuin]

I was not aware of this. Interesting.

People are used to fanfiction being free and readily available online, not paying for it to be published. So, there could be interest in 'published fanfiction', but many people are likely content with the authors whose works they have already found for free, to be honest. That being said... obviously there is plenty of interest in the Star Wars expanded universe and Star Trek novels and the like, so probably there would be a market for Tolkien-based novels, comics, etc, as well.

 

[Odola]

I was not aware of this. Interesting.

People are used to fanfiction being free and readily available online, not paying for it to be published. So, there could be interest in 'published fanfiction', but many people are likely content with the authors whose works they have already found for free, to be honest. That being said... obviously there is plenty of interest in the Star Wars expanded universe and Star Trek novels and the like, so probably there would be a market for Tolkien-based novels, comics, etc, as well.

Well, the phenomena of publshing fanfiction with "serialnumbers filed off", "binding fanfition" and even some third parties taking (stealing) popular fanfiction stories from fanfiction websites and publishing those in a print-on-demand fashion (sometimes also "rewritten" using AI) - as the copyright in their own countries is a more loose concept or not really implemented, especialy for foreign works - all this demontrates that there is for sure a market for them.

Sherlock Holmes stories - almost from the very start - had fanfiction stories called "pastiches" published [https://bakerstreetbabes.com/pastiche-vs-fanfiction-the-debate-that-wouldnt-die/: "Let’s make one thing crystal clear. All pastiche is fanfiction. Breathe into a paper bag and repeat: All pastiche is fanfiction. Anything written by a fan of something, inspired by that something, is, by definition, fanfiction. There is nothing inherently negative, suggestive of low quality, or second class about fanfiction. It’s been around for hundreds of years and will continue to be for the foreseeable future."], mostly with the blessing of the Conan Doyle Estate, but now, as Sherlock Holmes is wholly public domain, anybody can freely publish anything about Sherlock Holmes:

List of authors of new Sherlock Holmes stories - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

We can well expect similar for Tolkien's works.

But still, as New Zealand has the time advantage of 20 years against most other countries - its copyright period still being the old "death of author +50 years" (it has not joined the extention to "death of author +70 years"), imho it could very well make use of it.

[Generally differing copyright periods in times of worldwide shipping and easy border crossings are strange for books, as one can simply just buy/print-on-demand one while abroad in a place where it is already public domain.
Also, the copyrights for The Hobbit expire 1933 in the US (as it was published there before 1978, as such in a copyright transition period) while they are already past in New Zealand and will expire 2044 in the UK (and most of the EU and other countries). So there is a 11 year old gap when a theoretical US public domain Hobbit movie could not be distributed offically in some worldwide markets while the reverse is true for the LOTR books - a situtation which would encourages online and offline piracy.]

 

[MithLuin]

US copyright law generally changes to protect the interests of Disney, so I will not hold my breath for public domain Tolkien work here.

 

[Odola]

US copyright law generally changes to protect the interests of Disney, so I will not hold my breath for public domain Tolkien work here.

Tolkien "hated" Disney. And as an non-American entity, nobody will lobby much for his work in the US. Actually Disney might look forward to 2033 to make a Disney Hobbit movie as a form of "cultural revenge" - e.g. making "dwarfish dwarves" . ;-)

 

[MithLuin]

No, I mean, Disney lobbies to get copyright law changed so that Disney does not lose control of their own intellectual property - such as Mickey Mouse. So, while US copyright law might *currently* indicate that some of Tolkien's work would become public domain in 2033...the reality is that a lot could change between now and then.

Steamboat Willie (1928) has passed into the public domain, but everything else Disney is very firmly under their copyright.

 

[Odola]

No, I mean, Disney lobbies to get copyright law changed

1. what exactly does Disney want to change?
2. does it apply to individual authors or only to corporate copyright owners?
3. does it apply to literary works published before 1978?
4. how would it apply to foreign work?
5. how big are the chances to get Disney changes through and how soon?

and it would not apply to the rest of the world anyway - so Disney works could always be remade at other places - so how much sense would it make?

BTW:

China, New Zealand and many Asian nations/ some African nations/Switzerland	Death of author + 50 years [2024]
India	Death of author + 60 years [2034]
UK/UE (except Spain)/Australia	Death of author + 70 years [2044]
Spain	Life + 80 years (for authors that died before December 7, 1987; later: Death of author + 70 years) [2054]
US	Death of author + 70 years but for work published before 1978: publication+95 years, as such: [The Hobbit 2033] while [LOTR 2050-2055]
Mexico	A. works of authors that died by or before January 11, 1982, economic copyright expired on January 11, 2012. These works are in public domain now. (B. works authors that died between January 12, 1982 and March 23, 1997, economic copyright will expire 50 years after the date of death. C. for works of authors who died between March 24, 1997 and July 23, 2003, economic copyright will expire 75 years after the date of death. D. for works of authors that passed away on or after July 24, 2003, economic copyrights will expire 100 years after the date of death.) [https://reyesfenig.com/en/2014/04/17/copyright-terms/]

So Tolkien's works are also already public domain in - among others - China, New Zealand, Switzerland and Mexico. There could be some adaptations being done there now e.g. for the Asian market, which we will then come to see from 2033/2044/2055... And in China, like in New Zealand at al., anybody can already legally write and publish Tolkien fanfiction commercially. And it seems also that anybody could write and publish Tolkien fanfiction commercially in Mexico for a long time already.

 

[MithLuin]

Here is a brief overview of the history of what Disney has done to alter US copyright law thus far. I do not know if they will continue to push for changes in the future, or if they will pursue trademark to keep control of their intellectual property. Simply letting Disney materials become public domain without any sort of legal fight does not seem to be what they have done thus far......

Steamboat Willie is now public domain! But what does this actually mean for Mickey Mouse?

An explainer of the public domain and copyright terms in the U.S. in the context of our favorite corporate Mouse.

cfiesler.medium.com

 

[Odola]

Here is a brief overview of the history of what Disney has done to alter US copyright law thus far. I do not know if they will continue to push for changes in the future, or if they will pursue trademark to keep control of their intellectual property. Simply letting Disney materials become public domain without any sort of legal fight does not seem to be what they have done thus far......

Steamboat Willie is now public domain! But what does this actually mean for Mickey Mouse?

An explainer of the public domain and copyright terms in the U.S. in the context of our favorite corporate Mouse.

cfiesler.medium.com

Indeed, but they seem have reached the end of what they could do for themselves and extending copyright for foreign books does not seem important nor advantageous enough to bother. Still, trademarks cannot prevent literary derivates = fanfiction. Conon Doyle Estate tried to go this route - it is refused by the courts each time.
So while nobody could use "Tolkien" or the name "Middle-Earth xxx" for a series, as those words are trademarked for commercial use, generally describing a derivate literary work as a fanfiction placed in Middle-Earth or as describing the adventures of one of Tolkien's characters should be completely fine once Tolkien's works are locally in the public domain.

As such it seems you could make and publish SilmFilm already in Mexico [as Christopher Tolkien self-identified on the Silmarillion as only an editor, and not a co-author, and it would be of some legal difficulty for change this self-assignment posthumously].