Draft outline for Season 2

MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
I would prefer to show this story as 'real time' unfolding, not as legends shrouded in the mists of time. After all, the entire first season is more 'legendary' than this event. Meaning, I don't want to change the tone of the show. UNLESS the story is told in the frame, and it is told as a 'remember this quaint nursery tale my mom used to tell me!' which then cuts into the real events of our primary story.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
UNLESS the story is told in the frame, and it is told as a 'remember this quaint nursery tale my mom used to tell me!' which then cuts into the real events of our primary story.
That is exactly what I think we should do.
 

MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
But I mean not showing Ancient Arda at all while someone is talking about the three elf-fathers walking around discovering the 5 groups of sleeping elves. I think it would be extremely detrimental to show that. Because it is a story with a 'moral', and not a truth of the universe type of moral at that. [Basically, don't hold out waiting for something better, because it might never come.] If it is Arwen and Celeborn discussing this, Arwen can say that her mother told her the story, and Celeborn can be like, ah, yes, I remember telling her that when she was little. But keep in mind that Celeborn's grandfather was at Cuivienen (in our version, apparently), so to get from eyewitness accounts to nursery story in 2 generations sounds a bit implausible.

I am fine with having unbegotten elves at Cuivienen, and I am fine with them awakening with their partners. I'm also fine with three distinct 'tribes' there, if you will. But we don't want the viewers laughing at them, so I do not want to show the 'let's find the sleeping elves and claim them as our own personal toys' segment on screen.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
I agree with everything you're saying. That's why I'm talking about the Harry Potter movie, where the milieu is rather abstract. It is a story told by one of the main characters, showing a fairy tale world, which only later can be understood as a depiction of the real world.
 

MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
Yes, I recall the way they did the 'Tale of the Three Brothers' in Harry Potter, and that Hermione is the narrator. It's animated, and silent, like kabuki theater almost. It's also well into the film, so the audience is perhaps prepared for some narration/backstory at that point, to explain a key issue for the next film (the Hallows).

We're talking about the opening of Season 2 Episode 1 here, and I'm not sure that's possible. I mean only that someone in the Frame references the story, and makes a quick allusion to its content, and then we get to the 'real' story in Ancient Arda. I am not interested in retelling this in the Frame, as I don't think it adds much value to the audience's understanding of who elves are.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
Of course it's possible! We're in season 2, and let's not underestimate our viewers! We don't have to do it the way they did it in Harry Potter, but some kind of visual representation is necessary or it'll just pass by like some mumbling noise which will make viewers go 'Huh?'
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
But wouldn't it be more fun to include as much as possible and make the narrative as rich as we can? This is one of the few times we have the opportunity to put an extra layer on the story and give it that archeological touch that makes you feel the ages that have passed, the depth that is so very much a part of Tolkien. We have the frame but we spend so much time in both frame and main story that they both feel like our 'now'.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
Hmmm...well, sell Corey on it, and I'll go along with whatever is decided.
Well, since I won't have time to attend the session live, it will depend on whether he is for or against it beforehand. It'll be really hard to convince him if he already has a firm opinion. Especially if you are attending live and saying what you think about it... ;)
In the end, it's not that important to me, it's more like I think it's an issue that is important enough to give some time to look at seriously and discuss thoroughly. It's the beginning of the story of the elves, after all. The dwarves get one, I think the elves should have one as well.
 

Alcarohtar

Active Member
When the men come, do we want to have the lost tales version with the dark elf Nuin awakening Ermon and Elmir, the first of mankind, before the sun? If so should we introduce Fangli/Fankil earlier? This season? He could be involved with the super secret orc project with Sauron. The men have clearly forgotten their dark past that they fled from, but the dark elves could have brought the story West. I would like to see the battle of palisor in this tv-show.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
I love the idea, but is it possible? We have a lot of stuff already. This would be a whole new story thread. Still, I think the fact that it also contains Sauron as Thu makes it really interesting.
 

Alcarohtar

Active Member
I mean that we could introduce Fankil. He doesnt need to have any lines or be a central character, but just be there in the background. The story with the awakening of the men we have to take in another season.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
Ok you mean Fankil would be Mairon's ally? I thought they were basically the same person, but perhaps I misunderstood.
 

Alcarohtar

Active Member
Yes Fankil is I think a servant of Melkor. I think you were thinking of Tú/Tuvon, the fay/wizard who ruled the dark elves in Palisor.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
What I mean is that Fankil plays a role that Sauron plays (and Thu). We should perhaps have introduced him earlier, as it is the prominent bad guys are Mairon and Gothmog. It's hard to see a new agent rise while Melkor is imprisoned.
 

MithLuin

Administrator
Staff member
Well...we have room to introduce lower-level evil minions. We could, for instance, have Thuringwethil in this season, even if she wasn't in Season 1.

I don't think we will want the Fall of Man story to be in this project in any form, except perhaps told in legend-form in conjunction with Numenor. It has no bearing on the History of the Elves, and the Elves were not aware of it. It was also 'treading too closely on Genesis territory' for Tolkien himself, so he shied away from making anything too explicit there.

For us, Men will be introduced in Season 4. Season 4 will contain all the material from the Mereth Aderthad (Feast of Reuniting) to the Dagor Bragollach (Battle of Sudden Flame). So.....it's going to be a very full season! We will need several generations of Men, and there can be an allusion to darkness in the East that they are fleeing, but....we shouldn't get anything more than that.
 

ouzaru

Well-Known Member
I'm thinking we should probably bring up Thuringwethil for sure. I kind of feel like basically while Melkor is in chains, the lieutenants basically have a bad-guy Debate of Almaren at some point.

I would also be super comfortable leaving most of the early days of Men shrouded in myster. We're putting most of the Elvish stories under a microscope, and we'd probably have to do an awful lot of invention to get there, which I'd rather not do.
 
Top