During the episode on the Kinslaying much time was given to how the elves, and perhaps especially the Noldor, would view death. Thinking of Amrod’s death and the way Amras reacts, or at least the reaction as it was discussed during this morning’s episode using words like depression, I cannot help asking would he really react in that way? To put it another way. Is the loss of a brother, even a twin, greater than the loss of a spouse? I am not sure that it is, though I am not saying that is is less that that either. Turgon losses his wife, Elenwë, is he depressed? Elrond losses, though not through death, Celebrían. Is he depressed? I know that not everyone reacts to things in the same way. My point is not to say if others are not depressed at the loss of a loved one why is Amras? But rather to ask is depression even the right word or concept to use when speaking of the elves? Ambras heard the Doom so he knows Valinor is closed to them. Does he think that that closing also refers to Mandos inself? This seems to me very unlikely given the words of Mandos. “For though Eru appointed to you to die not in Eä, and no sickness may assail you, yet slain ye may be, and slain ye shall be: by weapon and by torment and by grief; and your houseless spirits shall come then to Mandos.” Note two things here. 1) The spirits of the Noldor return to Mandos. 2) It seems clear that many, if not most or nearly all, of the Noldor will at some point suffer death in some fashion. So Ambras knows that his brother is in Mandos and that even if the Doom is never lifted they will meet again, unless he thinks that he/Ambras will never die. It might be tens of thousands of years but what are a few thousand years to an elf? So what is he depressed over? That is a rather crass way of putting it so let me ask the question a different way. Depression is not really sorrow but is more akin to despair. So is Ambras in despair? At the loss of his brother, the manner in which he dies, the reaction of their father and family or the burning of the ships? Have this things caused Ambras to give up all hope? And this brings up an even bigger question. If he is in despar than what would his reaction be? Whatever my own or anyone else's thoughts and opinions on Catholicism in particular or Christianity in general may be, Tolkien’s world is distinctly Christian. I would go even farther and say distinctly Catholic. Therefor suicide is a big deal, a grave matter. Yes it does happen, Corey mentioned Maedhros this morning and I could add Túrin. Would Ambras, newly come from Valinor, even in despair kill himself? I am not opposed to his death but I am not sure about suicide. Maedhros was at least in pain from the Silmaril when he threw himself into the fire. Having Ambras commit suicide would be to parallel him with his brother, but also with Túrin. Do not get me wrong I really like Túrin, the Children of Húrin is my favorite of Tolkien’s stories just after Beren and Lúthien. But a parallel between Ambras and Túrin? It you really want his death to be suicide than might I suggest you make it Niënorian in nature? Yes Niënor commits suicide but her words “Water, water! Take now Níniel Niënor daughter of Húrin; Mourning, Mourning daughter of Morwen! Take me and bear me down to the Sea!” Seem to say that she is seeking something more than a mere end to present suffering but rather some cleansing… perhaps even something redemptive?