Script Discussion S06E04
- Thread starter Nicholas Palazzo
- Start date
Odola
Well-Known Member
It would be nice to see some of it again.
Haerangil
Well-Known Member
She didn't have any in Doriath...
They are from Lindon! Ironically the Eressean elves had them and gave them to the Numenoreans who grew them on their island.Tar-Aldarion gave some to Gil-Galad as a gesture of friendship (The endorian elves did not travel to Numenor! One of the reasons why the tv shows supposed version of Galadriel going to Numenor is so controversial) but for some reason they did not seem to have ever planted any in Lindon, why ever. But somehow some seemingly ended up with Galadriel who then planted them in Lorien at some point.My guess she did that after she withdrew there, which was way after Aldarions excursions makes sense i think.
They are from Lindon! Ironically the Eressean elves had them and gave them to the Numenoreans who grew them on their island.Tar-Aldarion gave some to Gil-Galad as a gesture of friendship (The endorian elves did not travel to Numenor! One of the reasons why the tv shows supposed version of Galadriel going to Numenor is so controversial) but for some reason they did not seem to have ever planted any in Lindon, why ever. But somehow some seemingly ended up with Galadriel who then planted them in Lorien at some point.My guess she did that after she withdrew there, which was way after Aldarions excursions makes sense i think.
Odola
Well-Known Member
So I thought.
Gil-Galad never saw mallorn trees in Valinor - as he never was there (before his death) - having been born to a Sindarin mother. His great-aunt might have recognised them for what they are while visiting him and got them passed on to her. That is not unprobable.
Haerangil
Well-Known Member
Aldarion certainly wouldn't just have given him some seeds without mentioning what they were!
Strange gesture anyways...
It must have been connected with the fact that the exiles were not allowed to return or chose not to accept becuase of pride, so Aldarion maybe thought he'd do them some good by giving them some Mellyrn? Gil-Galad and Cirdan seemingly found that unfitting, maybe because they never had been to Valinor or Eressea and most Noldor lived in Eregion by then?
I wonder... did they ever try to grow them in Eregion? If they ever had some they may still have been young and small when Eregion was destroyed... or maybe Galadriel had a foresight to save them and not plant them there... interesting questions, unrelated to the current season, but very interesting!
Strange gesture anyways...
It must have been connected with the fact that the exiles were not allowed to return or chose not to accept becuase of pride, so Aldarion maybe thought he'd do them some good by giving them some Mellyrn? Gil-Galad and Cirdan seemingly found that unfitting, maybe because they never had been to Valinor or Eressea and most Noldor lived in Eregion by then?
I wonder... did they ever try to grow them in Eregion? If they ever had some they may still have been young and small when Eregion was destroyed... or maybe Galadriel had a foresight to save them and not plant them there... interesting questions, unrelated to the current season, but very interesting!
Odola
Well-Known Member
Of course, but still they would be foreign to Gil-Galad while emotionaly significant for Galadriel as the trees of her childhood. Gil-Galad might be wary of introducing a foreign species into his beloved forest while she know exactly what it is and how to deal with it. Still we have established: no mallorn trees in Doriath.
Ange1e4e5
Well-Known Member
"We're wondering what the King is wishing tonight,
He's wishing he were in Scotland, fishing tonight"
Nicholas Palazzo
Well-Known Member
Ok, so this script having been outlined, folks may feel free to let me know if they have interest in writing it. Please contact me privately if that is something you'd like to do.
The Outline for Season 6 Episode 4:
docs.google.com
Silmarillion Film Project
Season 6 Episode 4
Script Outline
Protagonist - Beren
A-Plot: Beren and Lúthien meet and fall in love
B-Plot: Doriath - Daeron’s reaction
C-Plot: Doriath - Thingol and Melian
Frame:
Teaser: Frame
Act I
Scene 1: Northern Doriath - Beren is dreaming about Lúthien’s singing voice. He awakens in a glade in the woods. Sun is shining through dappled leaves, birds are singing - the world is a magical place. Beren gets to his feet. He is ragged looking, but no longer exhausted/ill. He looks around in wonder, and begins to explore his surroundings. He hears pipe music. Through a gap in the trees, he sees movement. A beautiful woman is dancing among the hemlock-umbels! When he stumbles out between the trees, she runs away, vanishing instantly.
Scene 2: Menegroth - Thingol and Melian. Gil-galad has left. Thingol is worried about the safety of all his people in the wake of events in Beleriand. Where is safe? Círdan has the havens, at least…but for how long? His plan: bring all the Sindar inside the Girdle to make them safe. His forest will be a haven of safety! Maybe the borders can be expanded… Melian (aware that the Girdle has been breached), warns him that there are forces at work beyond their control. The Girdle is what it is. The power of the king is great, but the power of Melian is set where it is set.
Scene 3: Forest of Neldoreth - Beren searches for the mysterious beautiful woman in Doriath. From time to time, he catches glimpses of Lúthien, but whenever he runs after her, she is not there any longer. Lúthien and Daeron observe Beren, and talk about him. Lúthien is pleased with how quickly he is healing. Daeron is concerned about the stranger in Doriath. Lúthien thinks there’s a reason that Beren is here, and wants to let this situation play out. When Beren comes closer, the two of them run away again.
Scene 4: Northern Doriath - In early spring, Beren sees her again. Tinuviel! Tinuviel! Beren calls out to her, and she turns back to let him ‘catch’ her. She then invites him to chase after her, and they run through the woods together, playing tag.
Act II
Scene 5: Menegroth - Thingol and Mablung play their well-established chess game. East Beleriand seems stable for now. (Well, except for the dragon…) Mablung suggests taking some of the soldiers of Doriath and help Finrod retake Tol Sirion. Thingol is resistant to the idea of sending any of his people outside the Girdle, and especially against having them fight under the command of the Noldor.
Scene 6: Forest of Neldoreth - Getting to know you - first real conversation between them. Lúthien asks him a question. He pauses, not speaking until she releases him from the spell. Why did you call me that? She asks how he speaks Sindarin. He tells her about his home of Dorthonion. He tries his best to impress her. They have dueling titles - the more epic his sound, the sillier hers sound. She gets him to smile.
Scene 7: Bird-hide in Neldoreth - Daeron and Lúthien continue their anthropological study of the mortal in Elfland. Daeron wants to discuss the subject. Lúthien wants to watch Beren…shhh. Beren is a friend to birds and beasts. He helps a critter in need, perhaps a wild pig. Daeron has questions about the long term plan. What are they doing?? She’s fascinated - he’s not what she expected a mortal to be.
Scene 8: Forest of Neldoreth - Lúthien brings a nice picnic to share with Beren. He is surprised that she brought a completely vegetarian meal without him saying anything. He has a ‘you too?’ moment. She draws out the part of his personality that he has usually been reluctant to share.
Act III
Scene 9: Frame
Scene 10: Neldoreth - Lúthien teaches Beren to dance. He is…not the best student, but he tries very earnestly. They stare deeply into each other's eyes. From Beren’s viewpoint, the lights go out and Lúthien is gone. Beren is confused, but resigned to his situation.
Scene 11: Neldoreth - Daeron finds out about Beren and Lúthien. He ‘pauses’ Beren and has a conversation with Lúthien. Lúthien is furious! Shocked, he tells Lúthien that she can’t be doing this - it needs to end now! What are you thinking?! What are you doing?! What is this!! She tells him that he doesn’t get a say in who she gives her heart to. He says he was willing to go along with this when it was just an academic situation. But now she has to get the mortal out of Doriath. Lúthien says she will take the matter to her father.
Scene 12: Menegroth - Thingol and Melian discuss the Noldor. Thingol criticizes their folly and their pride. The Noldor have not only been guilty of the kinslaying, but they set up and lost their lands in the leaguer, leading to nothing but death.
Act IV
Scene 13: Menegroth - Lúthien brings Beren into the court and introduces him to everyone. Thingol issues the Quest. Beren boasts. Daeron is an observer.
Scene 14: Menegroth - Lúthien and Beren discuss Beren’s sudden decision to accept a quest to Angband. Beren tells Lúthien to stay home.
Scene 15: Menegroth - Melian makes a point of talking to Beren, the mortal who walked through her Girdle. Melian gives him some food for thought about how his choices will influence the fate of Arda.
Scene 16: Menegroth - Melian and Thingol talk. They are not on the best of terms. ‘O King, you have devised cunning counsel…’ Melian warns him that he has tied them to the rest of Beleriand. Thingol dismisses the risk - what do you think will happen once he is outside the Girdle.
Tag: Frame
Script Outline - S06E04
Silmarillion Film Project Season 6 Episode 4 Script Outline Protagonist - Beren A-Plot: Beren and Lúthien meet and fall in love B-Plot: Doriath - Daeron’s reaction C-Plot: Doriath - Thingol and Melian Frame: Teaser: Frame Act I Scene 1: Northern Doriath - Beren is dreaming about Lúthien’...
docs.google.com
Silmarillion Film Project
Season 6 Episode 4
Script Outline
Protagonist - Beren
A-Plot: Beren and Lúthien meet and fall in love
B-Plot: Doriath - Daeron’s reaction
C-Plot: Doriath - Thingol and Melian
Frame:
Teaser: Frame
Act I
Scene 1: Northern Doriath - Beren is dreaming about Lúthien’s singing voice. He awakens in a glade in the woods. Sun is shining through dappled leaves, birds are singing - the world is a magical place. Beren gets to his feet. He is ragged looking, but no longer exhausted/ill. He looks around in wonder, and begins to explore his surroundings. He hears pipe music. Through a gap in the trees, he sees movement. A beautiful woman is dancing among the hemlock-umbels! When he stumbles out between the trees, she runs away, vanishing instantly.
Scene 2: Menegroth - Thingol and Melian. Gil-galad has left. Thingol is worried about the safety of all his people in the wake of events in Beleriand. Where is safe? Círdan has the havens, at least…but for how long? His plan: bring all the Sindar inside the Girdle to make them safe. His forest will be a haven of safety! Maybe the borders can be expanded… Melian (aware that the Girdle has been breached), warns him that there are forces at work beyond their control. The Girdle is what it is. The power of the king is great, but the power of Melian is set where it is set.
Scene 3: Forest of Neldoreth - Beren searches for the mysterious beautiful woman in Doriath. From time to time, he catches glimpses of Lúthien, but whenever he runs after her, she is not there any longer. Lúthien and Daeron observe Beren, and talk about him. Lúthien is pleased with how quickly he is healing. Daeron is concerned about the stranger in Doriath. Lúthien thinks there’s a reason that Beren is here, and wants to let this situation play out. When Beren comes closer, the two of them run away again.
Scene 4: Northern Doriath - In early spring, Beren sees her again. Tinuviel! Tinuviel! Beren calls out to her, and she turns back to let him ‘catch’ her. She then invites him to chase after her, and they run through the woods together, playing tag.
Act II
Scene 5: Menegroth - Thingol and Mablung play their well-established chess game. East Beleriand seems stable for now. (Well, except for the dragon…) Mablung suggests taking some of the soldiers of Doriath and help Finrod retake Tol Sirion. Thingol is resistant to the idea of sending any of his people outside the Girdle, and especially against having them fight under the command of the Noldor.
Scene 6: Forest of Neldoreth - Getting to know you - first real conversation between them. Lúthien asks him a question. He pauses, not speaking until she releases him from the spell. Why did you call me that? She asks how he speaks Sindarin. He tells her about his home of Dorthonion. He tries his best to impress her. They have dueling titles - the more epic his sound, the sillier hers sound. She gets him to smile.
Scene 7: Bird-hide in Neldoreth - Daeron and Lúthien continue their anthropological study of the mortal in Elfland. Daeron wants to discuss the subject. Lúthien wants to watch Beren…shhh. Beren is a friend to birds and beasts. He helps a critter in need, perhaps a wild pig. Daeron has questions about the long term plan. What are they doing?? She’s fascinated - he’s not what she expected a mortal to be.
Scene 8: Forest of Neldoreth - Lúthien brings a nice picnic to share with Beren. He is surprised that she brought a completely vegetarian meal without him saying anything. He has a ‘you too?’ moment. She draws out the part of his personality that he has usually been reluctant to share.
Act III
Scene 9: Frame
Scene 10: Neldoreth - Lúthien teaches Beren to dance. He is…not the best student, but he tries very earnestly. They stare deeply into each other's eyes. From Beren’s viewpoint, the lights go out and Lúthien is gone. Beren is confused, but resigned to his situation.
Scene 11: Neldoreth - Daeron finds out about Beren and Lúthien. He ‘pauses’ Beren and has a conversation with Lúthien. Lúthien is furious! Shocked, he tells Lúthien that she can’t be doing this - it needs to end now! What are you thinking?! What are you doing?! What is this!! She tells him that he doesn’t get a say in who she gives her heart to. He says he was willing to go along with this when it was just an academic situation. But now she has to get the mortal out of Doriath. Lúthien says she will take the matter to her father.
Scene 12: Menegroth - Thingol and Melian discuss the Noldor. Thingol criticizes their folly and their pride. The Noldor have not only been guilty of the kinslaying, but they set up and lost their lands in the leaguer, leading to nothing but death.
Act IV
Scene 13: Menegroth - Lúthien brings Beren into the court and introduces him to everyone. Thingol issues the Quest. Beren boasts. Daeron is an observer.
Scene 14: Menegroth - Lúthien and Beren discuss Beren’s sudden decision to accept a quest to Angband. Beren tells Lúthien to stay home.
Scene 15: Menegroth - Melian makes a point of talking to Beren, the mortal who walked through her Girdle. Melian gives him some food for thought about how his choices will influence the fate of Arda.
Scene 16: Menegroth - Melian and Thingol talk. They are not on the best of terms. ‘O King, you have devised cunning counsel…’ Melian warns him that he has tied them to the rest of Beleriand. Thingol dismisses the risk - what do you think will happen once he is outside the Girdle.
Tag: Frame
Last edited:
Odola
Well-Known Member
Love Luthien as an anthropologist.The Outline for Season 6 Episode 4:
Script Outline - S06E04
Silmarillion Film Project Season 6 Episode 4 Script Outline Protagonist - Beren A-Plot: Beren and Lúthien meet and fall in love B-Plot: Doriath - Daeron’s reaction C-Plot: Doriath - Thingol and Melian Frame: Teaser: Frame Act I Scene 1: Northern Doriath - Beren is dreaming about Lúthien’...
Silmarillion Film Project
Season 6 Episode 4
Script Outline
Protagonist - Beren
A-Plot: Beren and Lúthien meet and fall in love
B-Plot: Doriath - Daeron’s reaction
C-Plot: Doriath - Thingol and Melian
Frame:
Teaser: Frame
Act I
Scene 1: Northern Doriath - Beren is dreaming about Lúthien’s singing voice. He awakens in a glade in the woods. Sun is shining through dappled leaves, birds are singing - the world is a magical place. Beren gets to his feet. He is ragged looking, but no longer exhausted/ill. He looks around in wonder, and begins to explore his surroundings. He hears pipe music. Through a gap in the trees, he sees movement. A beautiful woman is dancing among the hemlock-umbels! When he stumbles out between the trees, she runs away, vanishing instantly.
Scene 2: Menegroth - Thingol and Melian. Gil-galad has left. Thingol is worried about the safety of all his people in the wake of events in Beleriand. Where is safe? Círdan has the havens, at least…but for how long? His plan: bring all the Sindar inside the Girdle to make them safe. His forest will be a haven of safety! Maybe the borders can be expanded… Melian (aware that the Girdle has been breached), warns him that there are forces at work beyond their control. The Girdle is what it is. The power of the king is great, but the power of Melian is set where it is set.
Scene 3: Forest of Neldoreth - Beren searches for the mysterious beautiful woman in Doriath. From time to time, he catches glimpses of Lúthien, but whenever he runs after her, she is not there any longer. Lúthien and Daeron observe Beren, and talk about him. Lúthien is pleased with how quickly he is healing. Daeron is concerned about the stranger in Doriath. Lúthien thinks there’s a reason that Beren is here, and wants to let this situation play out. When Beren comes closer, the two of them run away again.
Scene 4: Northern Doriath - In early spring, Beren sees her again. Tinuviel! Tinuviel! Beren calls out to her, and she turns back to let him ‘catch’ her. She then invites him to chase after her, and they run through the woods together, playing tag.
Act II
Scene 5: Menegroth - Thingol and Mablung play their well-established chess game. East Beleriand seems stable for now. (Well, except for the dragon…) Mablung suggests taking some of the soldiers of Doriath and help Finrod retake Tol Sirion. Thingol is resistant to the idea of sending any of his people outside the Girdle, and especially against having them fight under the command of the Noldor.
Scene 6: Forest of Neldoreth - Getting to know you - first real conversation between them. Lúthien asks him a question. He pauses, not speaking until she releases him from the spell. Why did you call me that? She asks how he speaks Sindarin. He tells her about his home of Dorthonion. He tries his best to impress her. They have dueling titles - the more epic his sound, the sillier hers sound. She gets him to smile.
Scene 7: Bird-hide in Neldoreth - Daeron and Lúthien continue their anthropological study of the mortal in Elfland. Daeron wants to discuss the subject. Lúthien wants to watch Beren…shhh. Beren is a friend to birds and beasts. He helps a critter in need, perhaps a wild pig. Daeron has questions about the long term plan. What are they doing?? She’s fascinated - he’s not what she expected a mortal to be.
Scene 8: Forest of Neldoreth - Lúthien brings a nice picnic to share with Beren. He is surprised that she brought a completely vegetarian meal without him saying anything. He has a ‘you too?’ moment. She draws out the part of his personality that he has usually been reluctant to share.
Act III
Scene 9: Frame
Scene 10: Neldoreth - Lúthien teaches Beren to dance. He is…not the best student, but he tries very earnestly. They stare deeply into each other's eyes. From Beren’s viewpoint, the lights go out and Lúthien is gone. Beren is confused, but resigned to his situation.
Scene 11: Neldoreth - Daeron finds out about Beren and Lúthien. He ‘pauses’ Beren and has a conversation with Lúthien. Lúthien is furious! Shocked, he tells Lúthien that she can’t be doing this - it needs to end now! What are you thinking?! What are you doing?! What is this!! She tells him that he doesn’t get a say in who she gives her heart to. He says he was willing to go along with this when it was just an academic situation. But now she has to get the mortal out of Doriath. Lúthien says she will take the matter to her father.
Scene 12: Menegroth - Thingol and Melian discuss the Noldor. Thingol criticizes their folly and their pride. The Noldor have not only been guilty of the kinslaying, but they set up and lost their lands in the leaguer, leading to nothing but death.
Act IV
Scene 13: Menegroth - Lúthien brings Beren into the court and introduces him to everyone. Thingol issues the Quest. Beren boasts. Daeron is an observer.
Scene 14: Menegroth - Lúthien and Beren discuss Beren’s sudden decision to accept a quest to Angband. Beren tells Lúthien to stay home.
Scene 15: Menegroth - Melian makes a point of talking to Beren, the mortal who walked through her Girdle. Melian gives him some food for thought about how his choices will influence the fate of Arda.
Scene 16: Menegroth - Melian and Thingol talk. They are not on the best of terms. ‘O King, you have devised cunning counsel…’ Melian warns him that he has tied them to the rest of Beleriand. Thingol dismisses the risk - what do you think will happen once he is outside the Girdle.
Tag: Frame
Still no climbing Thingol nor spindle spinning court ladies od Melian - could those at least serve as a background for one of the conversations?
Haerangil
Well-Known Member
I wonder how Luthiens and Daeron's vanishing and running away is played out...
Roleplayers would say they probably have unvisibility and teleportation spells and not be completely off, but how do we excercise these? Music and illusion magic i suppose? Daerons fluteplay bewitching the senses? Any idea of well done fairy moments here?
I,like how Luthien is both observant and curious and playful.Very fairy like but obviously everything but stupid.Daeron putting Beren on "pause" , obviously he is a powerful magician by himself and could be a quite dangerous person!
Btw. I like the way Thingol,is played out as a capable politician and Melian is quite aware of the breaching of the girdle and higher powers at work! Thingol and Mablung playing elven-chess is pure gold.I'd like to design an elvish version of a chess-like game some day...
Roleplayers would say they probably have unvisibility and teleportation spells and not be completely off, but how do we excercise these? Music and illusion magic i suppose? Daerons fluteplay bewitching the senses? Any idea of well done fairy moments here?
I,like how Luthien is both observant and curious and playful.Very fairy like but obviously everything but stupid.Daeron putting Beren on "pause" , obviously he is a powerful magician by himself and could be a quite dangerous person!
Btw. I like the way Thingol,is played out as a capable politician and Melian is quite aware of the breaching of the girdle and higher powers at work! Thingol and Mablung playing elven-chess is pure gold.I'd like to design an elvish version of a chess-like game some day...
Last edited:
Nicholas Palazzo
Well-Known Member
I was having the same thought about Elvish chess. I think between us all we have enough game development experience to manage it.
Haerangil
Well-Known Member
Really? Cool! I thought it could be based on reconstructed fidchell or hnefatafl..
Odola
Well-Known Member
Whenever it is, please do put it in.
I am against too much about elvish stategy. Chess is pure stategy and trying to understand and anticipate and to fool one's opponent. Clearly not elvish strong points. Elves have a "fate"- approach to live (due to a much longer lifespan) while humans are more about personal "choices" - as those do have far more weight when one ones time is much more limited.
So a game about the management of good luck seems far more elf-appropiate to me - something like the "Royal Game of Ur" or the Egyptian "Senet".
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Haerangil
Well-Known Member
For rpg/fanfic i once made up that the elves played a game called "Panta" which was similar to modern chess...
Now Panta is obsolete Quenya and possibly not a good name for a game enjoyed by sinda elves...
Some people think irish fidchell comes from a celtic word meaning "wood-intelligence", that could translate as "Gladhannas" in Sindarin.I could see the king of a forest realm playing a strategic board game called "wood-intelligence" which may or may not include Osanwe-kenta!
Now Panta is obsolete Quenya and possibly not a good name for a game enjoyed by sinda elves...
Some people think irish fidchell comes from a celtic word meaning "wood-intelligence", that could translate as "Gladhannas" in Sindarin.I could see the king of a forest realm playing a strategic board game called "wood-intelligence" which may or may not include Osanwe-kenta!
We have shown Mablung and Thingol playing this game before. The important details are that it be turn-based and they can chat between turns. And it has to be complex enough that they are both still interested many, many years later. So, a strategy game of some sort makes sense. Obviously, it's not really chess.
Some musings on Sindarin Chess (ChesSind?):
Name could be something like "Game of Kings" translated into Sindarin.
12x12 board? I recall a misconception being spread through the conlanging community that "Elvish uses base 12" but I don't believe this is corroborated in Tolkien's works as far as I've read, but it serves to differentiate it. I think an odd numbered board side is decidedly un-Elvish.
Depending on history, ChesSind is one of the following:
If it originated near the Awakening: Not a war game. Probably an area defense game? Map looks something like Cuivienen (terrain features do occur in actual games in the chess family such as Xiangqi).
Along the journey to Valinor: Could conceivably be a war game. Maybe based on the War of the Powers? I expect that theme would have fallen out of favor by the time of the Rising of the Sun.
After the sleep of Elwe: Could be a war game or a game of courtly politics?
During the first wars with Morgoth: Probably a war game.
After the arrival of the Noldor: Probably a war game, but almost certainly not about the war with Morgoth.