Session 4-18: Episodes 7 & 8

MithLuin

Well-Known Member
The next Silm Film session will be held at the NEW time of THURSDAY June 20th at 10 PM (ET) (not AM)

The topic will focus on Episodes 7 and 8 of Season 4.

Link to Gantt Chart:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1QZ0PrqCvWz5jy8pWZBj3TpG3Bnt1hPqHBaGL17TB0Y8/edit

In these two episodes, the secret of the Kinslaying will be fully revealed, and the consequences will put serious strain on the relationship between the Noldor and the Sindar. Also, preparations will be complete so that the next episode can be the Dagor Aglareb battle, which means that we will be showing Morgoth coming to 'visit' Angband and work the Spell of Bottomless Dread on some of Sauron's recalcitrant captives -- including Angrod's wife Edhellos.

Feel free to post any suggestions for scenes in those episodes or ways that we can tell the story of the Ban!
 

Ange1e4e5

Well-Known Member
Scene suggestion: I see that Rog escapes during this time on the Gantt chart. Maybe a scene where he escapes, slaughtering a hallway full of Orcs like Darth Vader in Rogue One?
Or am I putting in an action scene that doesn’t belong?

Opening scene: Finrod and Angrod are summoned to Thingol’s chambers, where he confronts them over what he’s heard of what the Noldor have done.

If I’m doing a bad job contributing, please tell me.
 
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Rhiannon

New Member
Will Rog escape on his own or lead a group of other slaves? The Fall of Gondolin says that the people of Rog's house "had been much recruited by Noldoli who escaped from the mines of Melko, and the hatred of this house for the works of that evil one and his demons was exceeding great," so maybe the first members of folk of the Hammer of Wrath could be Rog's fellow escapees. There could be a scene in which Rog is being tortured be a Balrog, which could set up his hatred of Balrogs or even of one particular Balrog that he could meet again in Gondolin. Also, maybe Rog could take a hammer from a forge in Angband and use it as a weapon in his escape then continue using it as a weapon and the symbol of his house, the Hammer of Wrath. Or maybe the signal for the escape attempt could be a hammer striking an anvil, which would be the origin of the sign of the Stricken Anvil. Perhaps Sauron could get news of Rog's escape while its happening, but instead of sending forces to quell it, he releases Annael to go with the other escapees.

The reveal of the Kinslaying to Thingol and subsequent ban on Quenya is pretty well detailed in the Silmarillion and even has dialogue, so I think that scene should proceed just as it is in the book. Maybe, in a scene before the ban happens, Galadriel could be teaching Luthien a song in Quenya, which Thingol would afterwards tell Luthien not to sing. This would give Luthien a chance to argue against the ban and encourage reconciliation. She could even mention something about the importance of preserving Quenya as a language of lore so such songs would not be lost.

In order to show the effects of the ban, there could be a montage of the Noldor doing things like erasing Tengwar from carvings, unsewing it from tapestries, painting over it, and burning manuscripts (after copying them into Sindarin). If Orodreth's wedding comes after the ban, maybe there could be some kind of change in the ceremony that Orodreth would insist on in order to comply with the ban and one of the Feanorians or another less-repentant Noldo would comment on.
 

Ange1e4e5

Well-Known Member
How should Sauron be going about capturing Elves? There have been suggestions about who's in charge, I've indicated a preference for Sauron raiding settlements for questioning (and then later breaking).
 

Rhiannon

New Member
I feel like there shouldn't be any large-scale attacks on settlements to take prisoners, as this would make the Siege of Angband look ineffective. Maybe Sauron's forces could ambush small groups or lone Elves out travelling or exploring. Presumably, few Elves would escape from the attacks, so the news of them would spread slowly. There would be parallels with the Dark Rider from Cuivienen, and Sauron himself might even assume that form. Sauron and Thuringwethil could also disguise themselves or create phantoms in the forms of the friends or family of specific targets in order to lure them away, which could foreshadow the phantom of Eilinel that deceives Gorlim.

I could imagine a scene in which Angrod's wife is riding through the woods with several guards and then sees her husband riding towards them. He tells the guards that he needs to have a private word with his wife and takes her away from the group. Then, orcs or werewolves or cats jump out and kill the guards while Angrod reveals himself to be Sauron.

If Sauron goes after Curufin's wife, maybe he could deceive her by taking the form of Celebrimbor. In preparation for this, Sauron would have to study Celebrimbor a bit, which would help Sauron befriend Celebrimbor later as Annatar.

If Sauron goes after Caranthir's wife, it might be funny if he takes the form of Caranthir but makes some other Elves suspicious: "Did Caranthir seem a little too polite just now?" :)

Anyways, I don't think all the major characters who will get captured need to be deceived like this; some can just be taken prisoner after being defeated in battle, but it might be interesting to show deception being a large part of the project since it is Sauron's idea.

Another thing that might be interesting to show is one or more Dwarves being captured but refusing to work as slaves or be put under the Spell of Bottomless Dread. This would help characterize the Dwarves as stubborn and resistant to domination.
 

Haakon

Administrator
Staff member
Will Rog escape on his own or lead a group of other slaves? The Fall of Gondolin says that the people of Rog's house "had been much recruited by Noldoli who escaped from the mines of Melko, and the hatred of this house for the works of that evil one and his demons was exceeding great," so maybe the first members of folk of the Hammer of Wrath could be Rog's fellow escapees. There could be a scene in which Rog is being tortured be a Balrog, which could set up his hatred of Balrogs or even of one particular Balrog that he could meet again in Gondolin. Also, maybe Rog could take a hammer from a forge in Angband and use it as a weapon in his escape then continue using it as a weapon and the symbol of his house, the Hammer of Wrath. Or maybe the signal for the escape attempt could be a hammer striking an anvil, which would be the origin of the sign of the Stricken Anvil. Perhaps Sauron could get news of Rog's escape while its happening, but instead of sending forces to quell it, he releases Annael to go with the other escapees.

The reveal of the Kinslaying to Thingol and subsequent ban on Quenya is pretty well detailed in the Silmarillion and even has dialogue, so I think that scene should proceed just as it is in the book. Maybe, in a scene before the ban happens, Galadriel could be teaching Luthien a song in Quenya, which Thingol would afterwards tell Luthien not to sing. This would give Luthien a chance to argue against the ban and encourage reconciliation. She could even mention something about the importance of preserving Quenya as a language of lore so such songs would not be lost.

In order to show the effects of the ban, there could be a montage of the Noldor doing things like erasing Tengwar from carvings, unsewing it from tapestries, painting over it, and burning manuscripts (after copying them into Sindarin). If Orodreth's wedding comes after the ban, maybe there could be some kind of change in the ceremony that Orodreth would insist on in order to comply with the ban and one of the Feanorians or another less-repentant Noldo would comment on.
Let me say welcome to the Silmfilm forums, Rhiannon! Good to have some new blood here. I hope that you find it easy to navigate on the forum. Please check out the FAQ and rules of conduct in the Main Forum section: https://forums.signumuniversity.org/index.php?forums/main-forum.2/

Those suggestions are really good btw!
 
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