Beren's equipment

[Nicholas Palazzo]

As we do not speak about equipment itself any longer here I will allow myself a technical question - we have gone though Beren's equipment here - the conclusion we came to - and which was not opposed - is that Beren has to have Bregor's Bow with him when leaving Doriath and in Nargothrond - where he should leave it in Orodreth's care before leave for former Tol-Sirion. Will this be incorporated in the scrip outline or how will our conclusion here affect the script writing process?

We have not yet begun the editing process of E03, or even the outline of E06, but it is a detail we can include.

 

[Haerangil]

If you mean a classic movie duel, I doubt Beren would survive the aftermath of a prolonged encounter with a bunch of other Orcs waiting in the wings. It's also not very ... outlawy.

And by everyone, I suppose you mean everyone but the C-bros.

The only single combat he engages with that I can think of is a monstrous spider and a monstrous werewolf hopped on on Silmaril magic. Those are hardly fair.

I also do not see ot as necessary for him to act heroic in that scene. He murders Gorgol from behind, slits his throat, very much assassin, grabs the relic and vanishes into the shadows and thickets, possibly running for his life frommthe night eyed orcs...maybe he had prepared some traps before ,or he leads them into an area he know is trapped which he knows well enough to evade them, just a possibility.

 

[Ange1e4e5]

If you mean a classic movie duel, I doubt Beren would survive the aftermath of a prolonged encounter with a bunch of other Orcs waiting in the wings. It's also not very ... outlawy.

And by everyone, I suppose you mean everyone but the C-bros.

The only single combat he engages with that I can think of is a monstrous spider and a monstrous werewolf hopped on on Silmaril magic. Those are hardly fair.

Said wolf also bit his hand off (which is how he gets hopped on Silmaril magic). So he gets bested by the wolf twice.

Meanwhile, yes Curufin gets tackled and throttled, but that's the only time Beren gets an edge on any opponent throughout the story and even then Celegorm was coming up behind him to turn Beren into a shish-kebab until Huan turns on Celegorm. So Beren only wins half a fight in his entire story.

 

[Nicholas Palazzo]

Said wolf also bit his hand off (which is how he gets hopped on Silmaril magic). So he gets bested by the wolf twice.

Meanwhile, yes Curufin gets tackled and throttled, but that's the only time Beren gets an edge on any opponent throughout the story and even then Celegorm was coming up behind him to turn Beren into a shish-kebab until Huan turns on Celegorm. So Beren only wins half a fight in his entire story.

Except for the fights against Orcs in E01 and E03. But as it has been hinted, these are story questions, not prop questions.

 

[Nicholas Palazzo]

We found a way to preserve Bregor's bow! More later!

 

[Octoburn]

We found a way to preserve Bregor's bow! More later!

What about the Ring of Barahir? In E7 Thuringwethil uses it to discern who Beren is, but I found no mention of it in 8 or 9 so far. Should Luthien find it at the beginning of 8, or should Beleg recover it and take it to Doriath, to be recovered later by Beren?

 

[MithLuin]

Beleg is recovering the bow of Bregor from Tol Sirion, so he could recover both. Then we wouldn't have to worry about which hand Beren wears it on. On the other hand, having Lúthien find it and return it to him means he could give it to her as an engagement ring later. He could still do that when they return to Doriath, I suppose.

 

[Ange1e4e5]

What about the Ring of Barahir? In E7 Thuringwethil uses it to discern who Beren is, but I found no mention of it in 8 or 9 so far. Should Luthien find it at the beginning of 8, or should Beleg recover it and take it to Doriath, to be recovered later by Beren?

Does Beren having the Ring of Barahir factor into why Sauron sends the wolf after him? Sauron decides that Beren isn't important and therefore "saves" Finrod for last because he knows that Finrod is a powerful Elf-lord.

 

[MithLuin]

The Ring of Barahir is how Thuringwethil figures out who Beren is, and gets him moved into Finrod's oubliette.

 

[Odola]

Does Beren having the Ring of Barahir factor into why Sauron sends the wolf after him? Sauron decides that Beren isn't important and therefore "saves" Finrod for last because he knows that Finrod is a powerful Elf-lord.

The ring is originally Finrod's. If the choice is between somebody who carries Finrod's ring and Finrod himself, I would assume the latter to be considered the more important one of the two.

 

[Ange1e4e5]

As we have already threads for that, beyond the Nauglamir, Bregor's Bow, Beren's sword Dagmor that he looses (in Nan Dungortheb?), Luthien's spindle set, her loom.

Had Tol Sirion a location chosen for it as yet? And Neldoreth?

Has it been definitively decided that Dagmor is lost?

 

[MithLuin]

Yes, Dagmor is lost in Nan Dungortheb in Episode 3.

 

[Ange1e4e5]

Yes, Dagmor is lost in Nan Dungortheb in Episode 3.

Drat; so what's the point of giving him a named sword only for him to lose it and nobody knows he had it? Why not just give him an unnamed sword which gets lost and he keeps Dagmor? I would have liked Dagmor to be a constant companion for Beren until he dies, unless he's using a borrowed sword in his last battle to recover the Silmaril from the Dwarves.

 

[MithLuin]

He brings the Bow of Bregor out of Dorthonion. He does not manage to keep Dagmor after being attacked by the spiders.

 

[Ange1e4e5]

He brings the Bow of Bregor out of Dorthonion. He does not manage to keep Dagmor after being attacked by the spiders.

Why can't he bring both? If he loses Dagmor it might as well not be there at all; what's the point of giving it a name if nobody would have known Beren had a sword? Anyways, what's Beren going to fight the Dwarves with at Tol Galen, an antler?

 

[MithLuin]

Losing Dagmor in Nan Dungortheb does not mean that Beren will never touch a blade again. But whatever weapon he uses against the dwarves will be suitable to a one-handed warrior.

 

[Odola]

Drat; so what's the point of giving him a named sword only for him to lose it and nobody knows he had it? Why not just give him an unnamed sword which gets lost and he keeps Dagmor? I would have liked Dagmor to be a constant companion for Beren until he dies, unless he's using a borrowed sword in his last battle to recover the Silmaril from the Dwarves.

If you wish Dagmor to find a more worthy end, how about it geting stuck in Shelob's body and its hilt is still visible and that is how we recognise her later? (missing some eyes is not so much visible imho in a spider, also spiders do molt and can regrow limbs but if it stuck deep enough maybe this would be kind of dismissable?)

 

[Nicholas Palazzo]

If you wish Dagmor to find a more worthy end, how about it geting stuck in Shelob's body and its hilt is still visible and that is how we recognise her later? (missing some eyes is not so much visible imho in a spider, also spiders do molt and can regrow limbs but if it stuck deep enough maybe this would be kind of dismissable?)

Depending on the variety of spider, missing a large eye in the pattern would stand out, but I am liking the idea of of the sword getting caught so that we see it when Frodo and Sam encounter her 20 seasons later!

 

[Ange1e4e5]

If you wish Dagmor to find a more worthy end, how about it geting stuck in Shelob's body and its hilt is still visible and that is how we recognise her later? (missing some eyes is not so much visible imho in a spider, also spiders do molt and can regrow limbs but if it stuck deep enough maybe this would be kind of dismissable?)

Why does he have to lose the sword in the first place?

 

[Odola]

Why does he have to lose the sword in the first place?

Because if he had entered Doriath armed, Luthien would be traitor to her nation for not having reported him straigth away.