Elven military

Discussion in 'Season 3' started by Haerangil, Apr 28, 2017.

  1. Haerangil

    Haerangil Well-Known Member

    Following
    Nicholas Palazzos
    thoughts in the Swords threat
    I ve tried to briefly sketch the early Elven Warriors:

    [​IMG]

    I#ve also tried to include as much from Anastasias costume design elements as I could (with little detail though) but in lack of more different costumes for the classes I had to reach bach for some of the older designs from earlier times of the wandering too. In lack of Costumes for the Sindar i also chose to use some of the older teleri clothes as the Sindar may have dressed similarly.

    1 is a Feanorian Heavy Warrior, he wields a long spear, long sword, great Roundshield
    wears scale Armour similar to roman one, a high Helmet with a plume and greaves

    2 is a feanorian Noble, those who would later become the Knightly class. This one is not yet a horseman.He wears clothing similar to the Hoplite, High Helmet with Plume, long Sword, but no greaves

    3 is a Feanoreian light Warrior, he wears linen armour instead of plate and might wield short Spear/Javelin, Longbow and Dagger or other shortblade

    4 is a fingolfinian Warrior. he wears a small roundshield and short Spear or Javelin and probably a mid or shortblade. He too wears Linen Armour.

    5 is a Fingolfinian light Warrior. No armour and Armed with Longbow

    6 is a Doriathrin Elite Warrior. Since i didn't know how we have to imagine early Sindarin Helmet types I chose to give him something similar to a higher version of a Wendelhelm, as i suggest the Sindar may have worn dwarven Helmets or Masks in the earliest days, or at least Helms influenced or much similar to those.
    he#s clad in fine chainmail and wields a small roundshield and a one-hand one-edged axe.

    7 is a Sindarian Militiaman. No armour or at last only linen armour, no helmet and armed with a spear, similar to brader dwarven-spears, lomgbow and short or mid blade.
     
    Haakon, Ange1e4e5 and ruth barratt like this.
  2. ruth barratt

    ruth barratt Member

    Oddly I was watching 300 the other day and was thinking that the hoplites from Greece would be a good starting point for one class of our warriors. (however with a *bit* more clothing then 300)
    I would also like to think about putting some of the Doriathrin guards into camouflage. this would work well for number 7 I think
     
    Marielle likes this.
  3. Haerangil

    Haerangil Well-Known Member

    +takingnotes+

    well the galadhrim gave the members of the fellowship seemingly. magical cloaks... i guess the sindar and nandor might have used similar camouflage...

    of course most of the wars take place in the northern regions... they should have worn more clothes (of course hallstatt celtic or etruscan warriors didnt look that different from greek ones).
     
  4. Marielle

    Marielle Well-Known Member

    Greek hoplite warfare would be a great inspiration, but we have to remember... a hoplite couldn't really fight well on his own. Their shields were large, and heavy, and designed to be "locked" together with those of the men besides them. The hoplite phalanx moved together in a unit, with everyone but the leftmost hoplites (who didn't have a neighbor's shield covering their left side) incredibly well protected. All this is to say that hoplite would be a great inspiration for ground troops that fight as a unit, not individual hero characters.

    The other great thing about the hoplite phalanx is that the Romans took it and modified it into their own, legion-based, system -- so we have an obvious means of showing development in elven warfare, if they fight with the phalanx in the Dagor Bragalloch and with a legion/cohort/century system later.
     
  5. Nicholas Palazzo

    Nicholas Palazzo Well-Known Member

    Well, the advantage of the maniple, or later cohort system has a lot to do with the division of units. Individual units can accomplish more complex formations than a phalanx can. Remember, however, that even the phalanx has to be supported by skirmishers and archers to protect from flanking maneuvers.

    If, by the Battle of Sudden Flame, the armies of Angband have developed a sort of blitzkrieg tactic to break elvish formations of heavy infantry with large creatures (trolls, ballots, Glaurung), and utilize large numbers of light infantry to press that advantage, the elvish response, to my mind, is to pursue a more mobile model. That gives us heavy cavalry, and horse archers, supported by pike squares, bowman, and light skirmishers (Men) by the time we get to the Battle of Unnumbered Tears.
     
  6. Haerangil

    Haerangil Well-Known Member

    great ideas... i see the battle panorama unfolding before my eyes... i think it's absolutely clear that this series wozld need great battle scenes. but realistic looking ones... not anything pj like. if course we also need heroic duels...
     
  7. Nicholas Palazzo

    Nicholas Palazzo Well-Known Member

    One point about this, and it is a finicky one, but I just want to try and maintain continuity of terminology. I know that most RPGs label a one-handed sword as a "long sword," but that name is, in contemporary accounts, typically reserved for swords which are designed to be used two-handed (a hand-and-a-half sword counts) as a primary weapon. A one-handed sword as depicted here was typically just called a "sword", but most historians today call them "arming swords" for clarification.
     
  8. Haerangil

    Haerangil Well-Known Member

    definitions are always tricky... we had that with the messer weapon too. in german langes schwert or long sword is also used for one handed blades longer than a roman gladius. as i understand it the main difference later was the hilt... classic medieval longsword/hand-a-half swords had a longer hilt than arming swords. of course the noldo fighters who wear spear and shield should use swords with a shorter hilt for only one handed use..
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2017
    Nicholas Palazzo likes this.
  9. Haerangil

    Haerangil Well-Known Member

    i was thinking about nandor warriors recently...

    i would like them to go a bit more tribal or native in design.

    i was thinking about giving them some sort of headpiece or "screen"... any ideas or possible cultural references?

    i was thinking of simething leaflike of made of leaves, sumular to thranduuls criwn maybe, but perhaps something that could also work as sime kind of camouflage..
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017
  10. Haerangil

    Haerangil Well-Known Member

  11. Haerangil

    Haerangil Well-Known Member

    I recently reread a description of thingol in my home pdf collection... It gave some interesting detail on his equipment:
    • AranrĂșth (sword forged of dwarven-steel)
    • Axe
    • Belt of Gold
    • buckler
    • Corslet
    • fishes' mail coat of linked mail of steel and gold
    • Golden Crown
    • high Helmet of Gold
    • Spear
    • Wreath of scarlet leaves
    But i guess this is late thingol, after the sindar had been equipped by dwarven smiths...

    However i find the axe, spear, buckler& corslet mentioned interesting... Can this be some hint on the earlier sinda warriors?
     

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